Ultimate heritage & history
A friend just interviewed me today for a school project on traditions and oral history. So, of course I spoke about the stories and traditions that have been passed down year to year on Stanford Superfly. In telling her about some of what I consider the team's heritage, I realized that the new history book, Ultimate: The First Four Decades, has the ability to help create a collective sense of heritage in the ultimate community.
When I was first starting the game, I fell in love with stories my teammates and coach would tell about players, teams, and big games of the past. Hearing about come-from-behind wins and dominant play inspired me to want to be able to do the same. I feel pretty lucky that my first coach, JD, was especially prone to telling stories and making them as real and exciting as possible.
I'm sure that other teams have their own oral history with stories that get told from one year to the next. However, I wonder how many people know about some of the pioneer players and teams that truly shaped the way the game is played today. Although I agree with Kenny Dobyns' assertion on rec.sport.disc that the ultimate history book doesn't do enough justice to the women's division and some of the most dominant forces of the game, I also think that the book is a great start for creating more collective knowledge about our ultimate heritage.
In reading and skimming through the book so far, I've thoroughly enjoyed reading stories about the start of the women's divisions; features on various teams including the MSU Fisheads, the Lady Condors, UCSB Burning Skirts, the Maine-iacs, Ozone, Lady Godiva, UNCW Seeweed, and Stanford Superfly; game recaps from various club and college Nationals; and other miscellaneous trivia. There are quotes from big-name players across the country and pictures that I haven't seen before. There are still a number of games and rivalries that weren't covered in the book, but it's absolutely wonderful to have so much information in one place as a start.
Some of the information is also insightful in terms of determining what was so successful for teams of the past. In talking about the Maine-iacs, JD is quoted as saying, "they created a pressure-cooker arena at practice. They created people who do not choke...Tournaments were a different thing. There was all this anxiety and everyone who was suually screaming at you in practice was now screaming for you." Additionally, Lady Godiva players discuss the philosophy behind its team defense and how the team ran practices to always be on the same page with offensive fundamentals.
One of my main complaints is that the number and quality of pictures of the women's divisions are lacking compared to the men's. I know it must have been a complicated process to get top-notch pictures from decades ago, and props to the authors for including some sweet shots of older players from the Maine-iacs and Godiva eras. I just wish there were more dynamic pictures of women playing in college (of which there are two, by my count) as well. I also wish that the included DVD had any women's coverage. I've been trying to get a hold of as much footage of the women's game as I can, so I was disappointed that there wasn't much archived stuff for the women's side of things. Clearly I need to get myself to the UPA headquarters at somepoint and see if I can make copies of some of their archived material.
Moral of the story: check out the ultimate history book and keep passing down great ultimate stories to those incoming freshman. They could get hooked just like I did.
Random trivia from the book:
When I was first starting the game, I fell in love with stories my teammates and coach would tell about players, teams, and big games of the past. Hearing about come-from-behind wins and dominant play inspired me to want to be able to do the same. I feel pretty lucky that my first coach, JD, was especially prone to telling stories and making them as real and exciting as possible.
I'm sure that other teams have their own oral history with stories that get told from one year to the next. However, I wonder how many people know about some of the pioneer players and teams that truly shaped the way the game is played today. Although I agree with Kenny Dobyns' assertion on rec.sport.disc that the ultimate history book doesn't do enough justice to the women's division and some of the most dominant forces of the game, I also think that the book is a great start for creating more collective knowledge about our ultimate heritage.
In reading and skimming through the book so far, I've thoroughly enjoyed reading stories about the start of the women's divisions; features on various teams including the MSU Fisheads, the Lady Condors, UCSB Burning Skirts, the Maine-iacs, Ozone, Lady Godiva, UNCW Seeweed, and Stanford Superfly; game recaps from various club and college Nationals; and other miscellaneous trivia. There are quotes from big-name players across the country and pictures that I haven't seen before. There are still a number of games and rivalries that weren't covered in the book, but it's absolutely wonderful to have so much information in one place as a start.
Some of the information is also insightful in terms of determining what was so successful for teams of the past. In talking about the Maine-iacs, JD is quoted as saying, "they created a pressure-cooker arena at practice. They created people who do not choke...Tournaments were a different thing. There was all this anxiety and everyone who was suually screaming at you in practice was now screaming for you." Additionally, Lady Godiva players discuss the philosophy behind its team defense and how the team ran practices to always be on the same page with offensive fundamentals.
One of my main complaints is that the number and quality of pictures of the women's divisions are lacking compared to the men's. I know it must have been a complicated process to get top-notch pictures from decades ago, and props to the authors for including some sweet shots of older players from the Maine-iacs and Godiva eras. I just wish there were more dynamic pictures of women playing in college (of which there are two, by my count) as well. I also wish that the included DVD had any women's coverage. I've been trying to get a hold of as much footage of the women's game as I can, so I was disappointed that there wasn't much archived stuff for the women's side of things. Clearly I need to get myself to the UPA headquarters at somepoint and see if I can make copies of some of their archived material.
Moral of the story: check out the ultimate history book and keep passing down great ultimate stories to those incoming freshman. They could get hooked just like I did.
Random trivia from the book:
- In 1973 Sharon Appling was "the first women in history to score in an interstate Ultimate game" during a match beween Staples high school and Columbia HS.
- The first all-women game was played in 1977 in Irvine, CA, between Los Angeles and Santa Barbara players
- 1982 was the year of the first women's club Nationals, won by Boston Ladies Ultimate (BLU)
- The women's college division was started in 1987, and the first Nationals were won by the University of Kansas Bettys.
posted by Gambler at 5:02 PM
3 Comments:
So, I actually interviewed Teens for the book, but only one quote got in from the interview. I thought a lot of what she said was pretty interesting. Here it is, in (almost) its entirety:
How did you manage to run the team with so many strong personalities and so much talent on the team?
It was an interesting mix of people. Probably one of the best things that happened to Godiva was that Peg moved to Boston. And then Molly moved here. Peg had the ear of the team with Molly's backing, and with my backing, and other people believed in what we were trying to do, like Westy. Of course, as always, there were some issues, but as the years went on people saw that the system worked, we were getting results, we were winning tournaments, we were winning Nationals, and so it kinda built on itself. If people believe in the leadership, then they listen to what they have to say and then everything kinda works. And I tell you, it's really amazing that it worked for Godiva for so long. Of course, there's those late fall practices where everybody's on everybody's case. But we all managed to get through it and come together when it mattered.
Many talented women have tried out for Godiva and not made the team. How do you decide who makes it? How do you infuse the spirit of Godiva into the women that do come onto the team?
It's interesting, we've had a lot of really talented players that tried out and made it and a few who have fallen through the cracks for whatever reasons. We've had some people that have even played on the team and decided it didn't work for them and they left. We spend a lot of time with new players talking about basics, and, it seems kinda contradictory, but, footwork and body position and we concentrate a lot about on the mark and all those little things. And we gradually build a language, for our offense and for our defense, what we're trying to do and how we're trying to do it. And it's not always easy, it takes people more than a year to find how they fit in to this certain kind of offensive strategy, what they can contribute. One thing we always say on Godiva is don't try to do too much, don't go beyond your ability. We had a lot of dynamic players but we also have this offense that allows people who are really fast but maybe couldn't throw that well to have a spot too.
It sounds like from what you're saying that people that didn't make the team maybe didn't fit into the offense. Do you think Godiva's offense is the biggest strategic advantage that you have or is it more just the focus on fundamentals in general?
I think that the offense has worked for us. But it's just another thing that we have built, from the basics, from the ground up. And it's about a concept, not necessarily, hey you failed this test at this time or you called this play at this time. We kinda try and have a concept, a backbone to always go back to. And it's the same with defense, I think. We taught a concept. It starts at the mark, here's how you body position yourself with the mark, and then it builds on as you go down the field. So I think Godiva's biggest advantage is that, in all the years that I played, we really played a team offense and a team defense. We never tried to pit our best athletes against another team's best athletes. We try and take our concepts and say, okay, we're going to beat you as a team, whatever that takes. And I think probably other teams are doing it too, but for whatever reason our system seems to work with our personnel and our personalities.
Was there ever a time during your run that you thought it might be time
to quit, go out on top, earlier than you did?
That's interesting, no, I never wanted to. Of course, probably a year before I retired, we started talking about it, because Peg - Peg pretty much retired. Even though she was around, she didn't really play for the last probably two or three years that I played. And also too, just me personally, I'd go to Nationals and I'd be like, 'God I don't know anybody anymore! My generation has long since retired, maybe I should take a hint.' But I love the team so much, and I love just playing ultimate so much that I never wanted to quit before I did. I feel lucky that I was able to go out, to retire, after we won. I'm lucky that we won that game, and happy for the team. [Laughs] Because if we'd lost that game I probably would have played another year.
So, speaking of that, what were your best and worst moments playing for
Godiva?
I was thinking about this, because I thought you might ask this. I think my best moment, the best time, was: We were playing Women on the Verge in the finals of Nationals in 98 and we went down early and hard and we were down 10 to 4 at half. We were just being outplayed. And we turned it around and we ended up winning that game 17-16. And during that game, someone called a time out, and Molly came stomping out. We were down by, I don't know - a lot. And she said, "We're going to need that time out during our comeback!" And I just remember thinking, "Comeback?" It's like this crazy possibility. And then we won that game, it was just a great moment for the team, people were psyched. We had some of the young girls that year, Shana and Vy, they learned - we may be down but we're never out. [Laughs] So that was absolutely my best moment with the team.
My worst moment with the team - I didn't think about this but it's easy - was: We went to Sweden to represent the US at Worlds in 96. And we got just slammed in the finals and we lost to Sweden in a stadium full of people chanting "Sver-ige, Sver-ige". And it was just really, I mean, I kind of, I - I woke up for a month or two after, I'd sometimes wake up and be like oh! [gasps]. It was just terrible. I felt like we let down - you know, we were the first US team to ever lose at Worlds, and it was just a hard thing to deal with. But, really, we came back that year, and we won Nationals that year, and so it didn't destroy the team. Which is - it was such a horrible moment, to see us totally just - we came apart at the seams, in the game, and then we came back. So, yeah, it went from a bad moment to a good moment. Because we came together, and it helped us, I think, really. I was really psyched to go to Worlds and represent the US and then I was like, ooooh. And we ended up beating Sweden in 1998 Worlds. By a lot.
And that felt good.
It did. People were talking it up like, 'Sweden doesn't have the same team as they did in 96 and blah-blah-blah-blah-blah'. But we didn't care, we needed to get them.
What do you think in general about women's ultimate these days, especially with the influence of coed - do you think it has lost out? Where do you see the direction of women's ultimate in the next couple of years?
It doesn't strike me that it has lost out to coed, though I guess it would be interesting to see this year. But I was thinking about this also, kind of reflecting on where women's ultimate is going. I see, just as the sport becomes more popular, an influx of really good athletes. It's really exciting, here in the Boston area. We're getting all kinds of girls. It used to be just soccer players. But now it's basketball players, and they're big and they're fast. The level of atheleticism has definitely risen over the last couple of years especially. It's really, really exciting to see. And I think that has a lot to do with the growth of college ultimate. It's just booming. It doesn't strike me that people that want to play really competitive ultimate are choosing coed over women's.
One other thing about women's ultimate I think that's really great to see is - when I first started years ago there weren't a lot of women that had all the throws. There were definitely dominant throwers in the game. But now, teams competing at Nationals you're going to see, a lot of teams have, you know, most people have all the throws, maybe not well, but. The skills seem to run deeper on every team than they used to. And that's awesome. That means that people are playing longer, and people start in
college, instead of after college like I started. So I think women's ultimate is exciting to watch and it was great to be a spectator. Even though I was rooting for Godiva last year, it's nice to see the other teams and really appreciate the sport and how far it's come in my lifetime of playing. [Laughs] You gotta understand that I was playing before we had numbers on our shirts.
Do you think that you'll keep going to watch? Are you going to keep going to Nationals?
I will, because I think it's important to support the sport. I mean, if we're not going to watch it, who is? And for years, Nationals was kind of this tense time. I'd go there tense, I had to get to bed early, and be worried about hydrating, and be worried about the team and be worried about what we were doing. And it's really nice to go as a spectator and not be worried about that so much, and get to watch men's games too. I look forward to going again this year. I wish there were more tournaments close by, because I would, I love it. I love to watch, and relax and watch.
Thanks for posting this interview, Neva. I think my favorite quote is: "I think Godiva's biggest advantage is that, in all the years that I played, we really played a team offense and a team defense. We never tried to pit our best athletes against another team's best athletes."
This seems entirely different from the way the open game is played today. I think that women's teams today try to use a combination of athlete match-ups and team defense, but I wonder which is the focus for most teams out there.
Clarification:
There is some women's coverage on the DVD that comes with the book. It includes a little rough footage from back in the day and some women's portions of the 2000 Above & Beyond video. It's just disappointing how little there is.
Of course, the interviews and footage that did make the final cut are really fascinating. It's great to see how much the game has changed (style, outfits, discussions, fouls, etc.) and how certain elements (the emotions of winning and losing, for instance) remain exactly the same.
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